Although this is obviously a step in the right direction it needs to be followed up with security updates, no point increasing the life of the hardware without doing the same for the software.
Making it illegal to lock bootloaders would make each device community-maintainable.
Yes! That would be the best. We should have access to our hardware. And just like most things you want to keep around for a long time (e.g. cars) you will have to tinker with it to keep it running smoothly into old age.
While it is certainly nice to have continued support, I think I’d disagree that forcing companies to maintain software on legacy/outdated hardware is something that should be legislated. I think that would greatly stifle innovation in a lot of cases.
If this goes through, I think it would be really good news. Battery failure is one of the leading things that force people to replace their smartphones, and having them be replaceable would go a long way towards making smartphones last longer.
If the manufacturer wants to force you to upgrade they still can… they can stop making the battery that works with your phone model (and notch them to make sure they can’t fit).
Back in the day there were some manufacturers that made batteries that worked with several of their models, Nokia was one of them, but not all of them did.
Even Nokia had a deprecation cycle for battery models and when that happened you were stuck buying crappy Chinese copies.
But they are replaceable in that sense. You can take it back the the manufacturer or to one of those independent phone stores and they’ll swap out a battery for you.
I don’t think a user swappable battery is actually a feature most users need. Not when smartphones get over a day out of a charge, you can charge at home, work or in a car, and external batteries exist.
That’s where I have to disagree. Perhaps in your country you have lots of OEM repair stores but where I live we have none. Only 3rd party guys who are totally independent.
I had a LG V30 in mint condition but the battery was done. No one has that battery and no one is interested in getting it because LG sold so few devices here. You can’t even find cases for most phones, only Samsung phones or iPhone’s.
So I had to get a new phone.
This is very common in most of the world, especially the Developing countries.
What phone are you using? Both apple and Samsung have made their devices borderline impossible to swap the battery out. They will then charge you an arm and a leg for sometime that used to be an easy swap.
I do miss being able to swap out a phone battery and this will certainly be a step in the right direction in terms ewaste and device longevity.
One thing that I wonder about is waterproofing or water resistance. Some phones are basically waterproof in shallow water. How achievable is this with a device with a trivial way to remove the battery?
The Galaxy S5 sport had a battery door and water resistance. They just used gaskets.
You can have both https://youtu.be/Yn-R39-dtc0
People make this argument and barely anyone really uses the waterprooding features of a phone
I imagine water resistance comes in handy quite often for many people. It has certainly saved me countless times. Not that I need to go swimming or deep sea diving with my phone, but I have dropped phones in water, been stuck in the rain, spilled a glass of water, etc. I ruined many phones before it became common.
You know, I really like my Essential Ph-1. It was a lovely little phone. I had the little 360 camera accessory that snapped on magentically and everything. It was so cool! Then, 1.5 seconds, dropped into water from which I grabbed it instantly, and it was done. No warranty coverage for dropping it in water, and zero waterproofing, and toasted phone. So, yes, more of us “use” waterproofing on our phones than you would think. The thing is that it didn’t need to be this way. There were waterproof phones back before everything was glued glass slabs all the time. Galaxy S5 Sport as mentioned by @[email protected] above (and other “sport” edition phones). We have a lot of hygrophobic coatings and tech we didn’t have in the day of the Galaxy S5 series. We can do better now, if manufacturers are forced to.
Water proofing is for more than just taking it underwater though. It’s also for getting caught in the rain, leaving it on a bathroom counter while you shower, or accidentally dropping it in a puddle.
another EU win!!!
Phones were designed with non-removable batteries for a reason. It’s not just to screw w/ the customer and make them pay someone to replace their phone battery. It’s to aid in water resistance and to help with a smaller form factor. This will lead to nothing good. And I’m sure it will carry over to other countries as well as I’m sure a lot of phone manufacturers won’t want to make special models JUST for the EU.
Just another example of the EU imposing nonsense regulations that will screw over the rest of the world, like their stupid cookie popup nonsense.
if you see a cookie popup, it’s because the website operator decided to use third-party tracking cookies on their site; they could have easily spared their users the banner by using privacy-friendly analytics, or no analytics instead. blaming the EU for inconveniencing users with these warnings is doing free PR for the worst parts of the advertising industry.
First, that’s not true. Tons of websites use non-essential cookies for various functions that have nothing to do with tracking, all of which would be covered under the GDPR and require a cookie popups.
Expecting website operators to run we sites without any analytics and advertising is an absurd expectation. They have to bring in revenue somehow. That’s what privacy and ad blocking extensions are for.
Yeah, no, sorry. The EU fucked up the internet for the entire world.
Listen to the guy, please
I actually love all these regulations on smartphones (mainly by the EU), like the recent USB-C standard. That one in particular makes it so much easier to share chargers around the house!
As a USA citizen, thanks EU for making our cellphone companies not be dick’s.
USB-type C to become EU’s common charger by end of 2024
I mean… Sure, but we’ve had USB-C as de facto standard for many years now. When was the last time you saw a micro USB phone?
USB-C is standard for Android devices, but Apple devices still use lightning.
I know, but the person I was replying to made it sound like EU regulation is to thank for Android devices having USB-C
I can’t wait to hear the Apple marketing word for this feature. They’ll add some gimmick like the battery is held in with magnets and say “We call it MagPack and we think you’re going to love it.”
Just as long as it doesn’t resemble what the poors would use. Yuck.
Phones are getting more expensive so people are holding on to them longer, so it’s a nice quality of life improvement to remove the barriers to battery replacement so less people have to go down to a phone repair store to get it changed. The more of a hassle battery replacement is seen the more likely people are to just upgrade and create e-waste.
The problem here is that in order for most people to be able to replace the battery themselves safely they need to be really idiot proof. We’d need to return to back covers with latches or big screws and batteries in cases and contacts. This shit is bulky, heavy and hardly waterproof.
New iPhones use lipo pouch with a ZIF connector straight to the motherboard with a “pull to release” adhesive strip hidden under a panel with a single use sticky seal and two small screws. There is no black magic in replacing the battery yourself and the solution is small, lightweight and waterproof. However most people wouldn’t even know which way to turn the screws to loosen them and probably wouldn’t be bothered by throwing the phone away and getting the one with a better camera AI and more emojis.
[edit: deleted, echo chamber here. Android good, Apple bad. Moving on and blocking this community, can’t have a reasonable conversation, just like reddit I guess].
The difference is that most of the people isn’t expected to own a mechanical watch, but having a smartphone is pretty much expected. You cannot treat a basic commodity as if it were a luxury item.
[edit: deleted, echo chamber here]
People disagreeing with you isn’t what an echo chamber is.
This is very neat! I wonder how this is going to impact almost all phones these days having some sort of ingress protection. They glue the phones together to keep the water out, it would still be nice to have the option for water-resistant phones, but the manufacturers just gonna have to figure it out
Removable batteries existed in smart phones before. There are plenty of devices today, walkie talkies for example, that are fully waterproof and are battery swappable.
Manufacturers just want your money.
Well… most of those devices aren’t thin boutique items. Something a lot of smartphone owners want.
Do owners actually want thin? I’ve never heard anyone brag about how thin their phone is. I’m almost positive the thin fetish only exists so companies have a nice easy number to advertise, like all the useless numbers they slap on processors and TVs.
Thinness enables large screens while keeping the device usable/ergonomic.
Holding a brick ain’t exactly the same feeling.
Really hoping this happens. I want to be able to replace the battery on my phone after a year because the performance on the battery degraded by nearly half.
That being said, I’m also willing to bet some time shortly after this goes into affect, the cost of mobile service (at least in the US) will go up another $10/$15 a month, and phones will increase in cost by another $100-$200. Not because materials cost more, or designs change. But to preemptively screw people over.
on the battery degraded by nearly half.
One year nearly half ? wtf , even my 24/7 power used phone lost approx only 17% on battery health and its a Poco x3 pro
Probably keeps it on 100% for extended periods of time.
Mine charges very often over night, but I’ll try to never let it drop below 20% ( that’s the worst situation for a battery)
Above 80% also isn’t ideal but not as bad as sub 20%
Misleading title. Phones can still be glued. Waterproof phones still don’t need to have a user replaceable battery (the battery needs to be replaceable but by professionals).
Do you have a reference for that? From all the documentation I’ve seen elsewhere, that’s not true. There’s no exclusion for waterproof devices, and everything has to be possible with tools a normal person can buy (you might need to go to a local hardware store, but no unique specialist expensive kit).
The full law is here: https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/docs_autres_institutions/commission_europeenne/com/2020/0798/COM_COM(2020)0798_EN.pdf. It only mentions ‘water’ 3 times and none of them relate to waterproof phones (they’re talking about batteries of waterbourne transport & environmental impact of water use) so I don’t know where that’s coming from.
It’s totally possible to make waterproof phones with removable batteries - Samsung did it with the Galaxy S5 (IP67 - 1 meter under water for 30 minutes) way back in 2014 and there’s lots of other examples. It’s just not quite as cheap as glueing everything together.
Thank you for linking the text. For anyone wondering, here is Ch. 2, Article 11 regarding portable battery replacement:
Article 11 Removability and replaceability of portable batteries
- Portable batteries incorporated in appliances shall be readily removable and replaceable by the end-user or by independent operators during the lifetime of the appliance, if the batteries have a shorter lifetime than the appliance, or at the latest at the end of the lifetime of the appliance. A battery is readily replaceable where, after its removal from an appliance, it can be substituted by a similar battery, without affecting the functioning or the performance of that appliance.
- The obligations set out in paragraph 1 shall not apply where (a) continuity of power supply is necessary and a permanent connection between the appliance and the portable battery is required for safety, performance, medical or data integrity reasons; or (b) the functioning of the battery is only possible when the battery is integrated into the structure of the appliance.
- The Commission shall adopt guidance to facilitate harmonised application of the derogations set out in paragraph 2
“if the batteries have a shorter lifetime than the device” sounds like it could be exploited though, well folks the processor can only last 2 years on these new phones because of (insert random corpo bullshit here)
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-9-2023-0237_EN.html#title2
- By way of derogation from paragraph 1, the following products incorporating portable batteries may be designed in such a way as to make the battery removable and replaceable only by independent professionals:
(a) appliances specifically designed to operate primarily in an environment that is regularly subject to splashing water, water streams or water immersion, and that are intended to be washable or rinseable;
(b) professional medical imaging and radiotherapy devices, as defined in Article 2, point (1), of Regulation (EU) 2017/745, and in-vitro diagnostic medical devices, as defined in Article 2, point (2), of Regulation (EU) 2017/746.
I will assume that your example is the reason for your your comment, and while I agree this does open the door for exclusion, that is after all a reasonable one.
You cannot have a consumer device at a reasonable price point, designed to provide water resilience, which also contains an open section to the power supply.
You cannot have a consumer device at a reasonable price point, designed to provide water resilience, which also contains an open section to the power supply.
You certainly can. Look up any flagship smartphone and you can see that they provide water resilience and they have a charging port.
Stupid plain simple, increase in weight.
So?
